Andy Crouch is a writer, editor, author and musician based in the United States. He was the editor of Christian Today, one of America's largest faith based publications, and made headlines when he wrote an editorial criticising Evangelical support for Donald Trump.

In this episode, Elizabeth talks to Andy about his life in publishing and why he values language so much. He talks about the state of US politics, and why the virtue of patience is more valuable than ever in times of crisis and strife.

This episode also features a short interview with Nick Spencer about the American edition of 'Evolution of the West', and how religious terms get politicised by both the right and left.